HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Talk to your hearts content.....but keep it sweet! No record sales, live events listings or ebay labba labba.

Moderator: B&F Moderator

HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby warriorsteppas » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:16 am

Greetings,

I have recently used reasons and cubase software to produce dub music however, the hi-hats, snares, bass, horns, synths, percussion and drums don't relate to the style of reggae music i wish to produce.

The style I wish to produce is the old school non-commerical dancehall reggae music style featuring:
jammy's record label,
music works record label,
living room record label,
two friends sir record label,
vena record label,
live and learn label,
Virgo record label,
ruddy's music record label,
photograher record label,
redman international record label,
new name muzik record label
etc. mainly the JA productions!

can anyone help or direct or guide me on what software or equipment I need to make them style of tunes?
myspace.com/warriorsteppa
myspace.com/tidnrecords
warriorsteppas
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 11:16 pm

Postby Junior » Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:57 am

I'd say that reason is PERFECT for these kind of productions. I produce digital reggae myself.

Check 'em: http://firehouse.dk/?page_id=252

What you need is a sound bank of as many vintage drum machines that you can get hold of. Personally I have some 3-4 GB of vintage drum machine samples. This is essential, and will make a huge difference in the long run.
Second, you need to do the proper equalizing in reason. Reason has a great equalizer. But most other effect in the sequencer suck. Keys has to be a bit distorted, get rid of the low and high tones and give them a boost in the middle frequencies. Equalize hihats by removing some of the lower frequencies, remove some of the higher frequencies on your bass etc.
Reason sounds like **** if you don't use some other program to make the last finishing touch. Bounce each track individually and put them in a session in Cubase or whatever program you use. I use Adobe Audition.
Now, if you have the right vst plugins, making the 80's digital sound is pretty easy. First of all, you need the PSP Vintage Warmer. This is the best tool there is, nothing can compare in my book. Other recommendable plugins include the PSP 84 reverb box and the Izotope Ozone.

Basically, the drum samples in reason suck big time, but Thor and the Subtractor are really nice synthesizer that can last you for a very long time if you want to produce digital reggae. The Matrix is also a very nice tool. Reason has it all for producing this kind of music, you just need to give it the right finish in cubase with the proper plugins.
Trial and error will get you far. The best way to start is by taking equalizing very seriously. Every single track should be equalized to sound right.
Then having the right drum samples and plugins are the only two things you'll need. Good luck!
Last edited by Junior on Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
Junior
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:14 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Postby dougie conscious » Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:01 am

if you wana sound like the early digi tunes get yourself a yamaha dx 100 keyboard a oberhiem dx drum machine a yamaha cso1 keyboard, and play everything live exept{the drum machine}, hope that helps
dougie conscious
 
Posts: 2535
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 8:05 pm

Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby xiquet » Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:28 pm

warriorsteppas wrote:The style I wish to produce is the old school non-commerical dancehall reggae music style featuring:
jammy's record label,
music works record label,
etc


what on earth do you mean by non-commercial?! like jammy's never sold any records?!

that aside, interesting question and responses :D
xiquet
 
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 3:25 pm
Location: London

Postby Inyaki » Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:45 pm

dougie conscious wrote:if you wana sound like the early digi tunes get yourself a yamaha dx 100 keyboard a oberhiem dx drum machine a yamaha cso1 keyboard, and play everything live exept{the drum machine}, hope that helps


Exactly. The instruments are crucial.
Those producers (86-92) recorded on tape too, no computers. And they had "musicians" building the riddims, not programmers.
Inyaki
 
Posts: 1138
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 11:07 pm
Location: South London

Postby Junior » Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:51 pm

Yes, using the word "non-commercial" in relation to reggae and dancehall is basically a complete fallacy.
There's no way you can ever comprehend Jamaican music through European middle class, counter culture concepts like 'non-commercial', anti-mainstream etc. Those concepts make no sense whatsoever when it comes to reggae.
Maybe if you're into punkmusic, applying these words may will reveal some sort of meaning, but in a developing country like Jamaica such luxuries as taking a 'non-commercial' stance are basically products of abundance and welfare, which is very rare on the island.
Almost every dancehall tune is an attempt to make a hit. 99.9 % fail miserably, but that does not qualify the music as non-commercial.
Junior
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:14 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Postby Junior » Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:55 pm

Inyaki wrote:
dougie conscious wrote:if you wana sound like the early digi tunes get yourself a yamaha dx 100 keyboard a oberhiem dx drum machine a yamaha cso1 keyboard, and play everything live exept{the drum machine}, hope that helps


Exactly. The instruments are crucial.
Those producers (86-92) recorded on tape too, no computers. And they had "musicians" building the riddims, not programmers.


True, but they also used the instruments available to them, and that should always IMO be your point of departure when making dancehall.
Reason is a great tool to make the early digital sound. There's no need to get all the original equiptment (unless you're a puritan gear geek).
The tape sound can be applied to a rather satisfying degree usin the Vintage Warmer, and I don't believe many people can tell the difference between Oberheim drum machine samples and a real box.

Oh, and distinguishing between 'musicians' and 'programmers' is basically a waste of time IMO. It makes no sense when applied to reality.
Junior
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:14 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Postby Inyaki » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:18 pm

Junior wrote:
Inyaki wrote:Oh, and distinguishing between 'musicians' and 'programmers' is basically a waste of time IMO. It makes no sense when applied to reality.


Steely, Cleavie, Robbie Lyn, Obeah, Sly & Robbie, Firehouse Crew, etc... Top musicians who came from the Studio One / Channel One days....all play live instruments onstage too. Very different feel.
Inyaki
 
Posts: 1138
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 11:07 pm
Location: South London

Postby Speed » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:19 pm

where can you get this vintage warmer?
Speed
 
Posts: 917
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 9:34 am
Location: Manchester, UK

Postby Junior » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:29 pm

Inyaki wrote:
Junior wrote:
Inyaki wrote:Oh, and distinguishing between 'musicians' and 'programmers' is basically a waste of time IMO. It makes no sense when applied to reality.


Steely, Cleavie, Robbie Lyn, Obeah, Sly & Robbie, Firehouse Crew, etc... Top musicians who came from the Studio One / Channel One days....all play live instruments onstage too. Very different feel.


Yes, live onstage it's probably a very different feel. But when it comes to digital productions, you don't 'feel' any difference if it's a 'programmer' or a 'musician' producing the riddim.
It's just the classic old cliché about real music is made by real musicians. It's a meaningless way to look at dancehall. Steely, for example, is a 'real musician', but all the drum tracks he did for Jammy's was made by programming drum machines.
How on earth can you tell the difference between a digital drum pattern made by a 'real' musician and one made by a 'programmer'?!
Junior
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:14 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Postby Junior » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:29 pm

Speed wrote:where can you get this vintage warmer?


http://www.pspaudioware.com/indexen.htm ... tage.html;
Junior
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:14 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Postby munky lee » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:48 pm

Inyaki wrote:Steely, Cleavie, Robbie Lyn, Obeah, Sly & Robbie, Firehouse Crew, etc... Top musicians who came from the Studio One / Channel One days....all play live instruments onstage too. Very different feel.


sly, great musician but also...... great programmer!!!
munky lee
 
Posts: 51
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 10:53 pm
Location: France - Rennes

Postby Junior » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:57 pm

This reminds me of a part of the dancehall-hating-old-reggae-cliché Lloyd Bradley's book "Bass Culture", which I never hesitate to smear. In the last part of his book he tries his best to present dancehall as a degenerated, morally corrupt and uninspiring genre made by kids without skills.
One of his arguments is exactly the same, basically that the music is bad because it's not real musicians making it. Then he interviews Sly, who also program modern dancehall drum patterns. Sly is then elevated in the book, because he can also play drums in real life (the true hero of reggae). But the argument is meaningless. Sly's skills as a live drummer, has no relation to his drum programming. It's just an silly way to try to diss dancehall, but it's unqualified as a serious argument. It's a stupid book.
Junior
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:14 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Postby dougie conscious » Fri Feb 06, 2009 3:10 pm

you don't 'feel' any difference if it's a 'programmer' or a 'musician' producing the riddim

yes you do,like inyaki said all them early digi tune were played live{exept 4 the drum machine} straight to tape no quantise or loops,
you get a more human feel
dougie conscious
 
Posts: 2535
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 8:05 pm

Postby DC » Fri Feb 06, 2009 4:09 pm

Junior wrote:Sly's skills as a live drummer, has no relation to his drum programming. It's just an silly way to try to diss dancehall, but it's unqualified as a serious argument. It's a stupid book.


It definatly make a difference.. programmed by a musician or not.
For instance drum programming. I've heard many programmed drums where you can hear a hihat in 16th going on while there's a big drumroll goin as well. A drummer won't program that as he knows it's physically impossible on a drumkit. As also the feel in velocity.
http://www.facebook.com/dubcreator
http://www.dubcreator.com for Dubplatesamplers
DC on Itunes, Juno, Rhapsody, spotify, Amazon.
DC Dubplate Downloads @ RMS
DC
 
Posts: 1374
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 3:13 pm
Location: Netherlands

Next

Return to General discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] and 7 guests