What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

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What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Tune In 2 » Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:23 am

What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ef0_9E-4P3Y
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Animist Roots » Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:20 pm

Seems like the concept of struggle and fight against oppression, self knowledge, has been lost somewhere, and for some, reggae is only about love, peace and unity.
It makes me think about how the European scene is developing. In my country you can, generally speaking, find two kind of reggae people. The ones represented in the video ( not all of them,but you u feel me), everything is peace and one love, but when you try to go deep with them, and do some kind of reasoning, they got a superficial concept about what is reggae, one love is a magical solution.
The other kind troubles my mind often. They know that reggae stands for a revolution against injustices, and for a spiritual journey to find balance and righteousness. They do know that reggae is a black people music, a message from the African diaspora. They studied concepts like repatriation, Rastafari trinity and prophets... But instead of understanding the message, they take the message as if it was created by themselves. They are fast and ready to assume the identity of a Jamaican Rastafari and forget who they are, and where they come from.
There's people suffering for what they call ''Racial impostor syndrome'', but this kind of white people never doubt, them never question themselves about if what they'r doing is right. One day the dreadlocks, next day praising Haile Selassie. I approached this guys, and they act like a sect, a bad sect.
This situation really bothers me, and often makes me think about how this stereotypes are beeing feed in the reggae scene.
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Ranking Glasses » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:33 pm

Animist Roots,

Thank you so much for your post.

I have read it several times and it still makes me feel slightly uncomfortable as I sit here wriggling in my seat when I should be working. I said something similar to JB Welda and Me / Novice recently out of anger. Yes reggae was born out of the black experience and even when it borrowed heavily from the American music that was coming across in the 50's & 60's, that music was also mainly black music, i.e. jazz, R&B, Soul, Be-bop, etc.

I'm glad you mentioned Africa and the diaspora because when reggae moves into roots, Rasta and dub it is going back to the African roots which were forgotten / supressed for so long. I grew up in London to Jamaican parents and other relatives and ska / reggae was always a big part of our life, culture and identity. It was one of my parents ways of maintaining a link to Jamaica. We had lots of records at home which we used to play on a very grand Rigaletto gram and reggae was played at parties, christenings, weddings and even funerals. I moved into roots & dub when I got a bit older much to my parents dismay: "De bwoy turning Rasta".

The reason I feel uncomfortable is because although reggae was undoubtedly born out of the black experience, despite what other members of this board might say, reggae and music is for everyone. It is however hurtful and offensive to me when ignorant and arrogant people will not even acknowledge the origins of the music and act as if it's theirs. When they say that I know nothing about the music when it has been a big part of my life for 50 years and I was putting Doctor Bird, Studio 1, Blue Beat, Trojan, Duke Reid, etc. records on the turntable since I was a toddler.

In answer to the question, reggae is my culture, identity and enjoyment and I'm happy when other people enjoy it as well.

I know that bitter, sarcastic and hateful board members will want to make their s***ty little comments to ridicule me, but at the end of the day, some are leaves, some are branches but I am the root and nothing they can say or do will change that.
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby jb welda » Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:05 pm

Do me a favor and leave me out of your racist posts there, glasses, and I will attempt to return the favor.

I will save further comments for another time because i do recognize some truth in what is being said, but i am telling you straight out: personalize it as you seem to like to do, with me in particular, and it will all come back at you in spades.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOjYN2btUsY


jb
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Ranking Glasses » Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:20 pm

Strange, when I've just said that reggae music is for everyone and saying that it's"black" music makes me uncomfortable. The origin of the music is black and that's a fact but it doesn't stop other people getting involved. Is that what's making you so angry, a fact that you can't deny? Is that why you want to beat me up? But even if you kill me, the facts and history are still there and you will still be angry.

Have you thought about anger management counselling? It might help you to improve your relationships with other people. I had it after a difficult time in the 90s and it did me the world of good.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2nXGPZaTKik
Last edited by Ranking Glasses on Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Animist Roots » Fri Jul 13, 2018 8:24 pm

I give thanks for your responses, every answer to this matter contributes to put some light in a subject that has became slightly invisible as the reggae scene become bigger.
I agree in letting apart all kind of personal quarrels if you don't mind. Without going in about who said what to whom, i hope we can discuss this matter without negative interference. If we let that in, this exchange of opinions will die.

The reason I feel uncomfortable is because although reggae was undoubtedly born out of the black experience, despite what other members of this board might say, reggae and music is for everyone. It is however hurtful and offensive to me when ignorant and arrogant people will not even acknowledge the origins of the music and act as if it's theirs.


Of course, i think exactly the same. Reggae music is for everyone, for everyone who can understand the message and the vibes, even for those who can not understand, reggae could became a point of entrance to some truths they never thought about. But the problem comes when someone can not make a difference between what is being said and who are you. As I see it, some people got serious identity problems ( in the best case scenario), and there's another kind of people who are directly wolves in a sheep clothes, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yEzcmS5lt4 . Under my point of view, there should be no reason to feel uncomfortable Ranking Glasses, although having to witness this phenomena, when problems arise it's always an opportunity to let things clear. Even some indignation doses could give positive outcomes.
In my opinion, when someone get into something through music or through consuming some kind of substance, or through both things at the same time, and this thing goes far beyond about what music means, you should be able to make an introspective work to see what you're about, and specially who you are and from where this heavy spiritually charged music comes from. Unfortunately, for most of european artists, the rule nowadays is to be a poser, and they will find an industry that will support them imposter ways. Lots of confusion even between collectives that have been promoting the genre for many decades now, isn't it?

Reggae Music & the reggae scene are two different things. Reggae has many genres. Reggae means to me no reggae politics within the scene. I feel so far removed from the reggae scene, dances, social media that it all seems soulless & cultureless. Black & white people who have no soul & culture. Plastic Smile Culture on digital. Reggae music is freedom from all of that. These days the genre of reggae has no meaning.


I understand what you've said, and i relate with it to some point. Fortunately we still can enjoy some artists who are about the real deal. Something similar happened to hip hop. There's that big wave of **** in the surface, but sooner or later that wave will lose momentum. Yes, Reggae music is freedom from all that, in my humble opinion real reggae music has reached a spiritual height that is not easy to understand. But i think it will be a nice goal to see that righteous message finally producing something more than a scene. Maybe i'm wrong, but isn't that what reggae is about? A channel to connect with a superior reality of ourselves as individuals/collective. But be shure to know who you are, and where is your position.

Sorry if my english skills are not 100% correct.

Peace and strenght to you all.
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Dread Archive » Fri Jul 13, 2018 8:55 pm

Quote: Dread Archive
[[[[Reggae Music & the reggae scene are two different things. Reggae has many genres. Reggae means to me no reggae politics within the scene. I feel so far removed from the reggae scene, dances, social media that it all seems soulless & cultureless. Black & white people who have no soul & culture. Plastic Smile Culture on digital. Reggae music is freedom from all of that. These days the genre of reggae has no meaning.]]]]]

Same with the Hip Hop. To be there when the reggae moved on while the masses were on some watered down reggae pop. Music goes through phazes of good & bad. When things are bad there maybe only a few tunes a year. Drums machines changed Hip Hop & reggae. It seems the main stream has taken all the culture out of Hip Hop & reggae. Music has no barriers, but people do.
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Novice » Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:35 pm

It doesn't "mean" anything to me, it's music and I enjoy just like I enjoy other music. I have and do enjoy reggae in particular because it musically hits many of the right notes(no pun intended) on many occasions that strikes an enjoyable cord(no pun) in my cerebral cortex. The sounds make me feel the way I enjoy feeling or have on many occasions but other music does to so it means the same thing any music would mean but again, I have no idea what that is because it's not a question I would ask because it sounds as silly as someone asking what the color purple sounds like. I don't have synesthesia so I don't have a connection of colors with sounds for example the same way I don't have a connection with the concept of a music "meaning" something to me. The question is vague, confusing and downright silly to me. Are you asking about cause and effect with reggae music, well I just explained it above, it sounds good to me and that causes me to enjoy it so reggae means musical enjoyment to me....see, it's a silly question to me.

As far as coming from black people and that whole discussion, perhaps I'm a bit aloof or just don't particularly care about race when it comes to things like music in as far as I don't think I really think that much about it aside from recognizing that it's black people who are the majority of reggae music makers or hip hop or whatever and that I seem to particularly enjoy "black music." I don't claim it or make any declarations or exclamations about it except one, I know how to enjoy it and that's good enough for me.

Anyone claiming it didn't come from black people or at least wasn't developed into what it did by black people are just not worth arguing with or discussing with. I don't understand how you can get upset by that, it would be like someone claiming a tomato isn't red, grass isn't green...for me the discussion would end there or at least turn into a farce by hand at that point but to be hurt or offended by it seems silly to the point of making me look for an ulterior motive. Maybe YOU, as a black man, want to feel a closeness or have a relationship with the music you think is superior to that of a white man, maybe it's your ego out of control or maybe you've enjoyed it for so long before it was "hip" or before everyone else caught on and now you feel like your appreciation before all that is not being appreciated or acknowledged..that's a normal human feeling I think but it's also one you should get over because it can happen to everyone in some way or another and is in no way relegated to black music appreciation or acknowledgement.

Nobody likes a front a runner, if you support or like a music or a sports team then like it but when the music blows up or your team starts to win championships and everyone now climbs on board, YEA that's frustrating and gets you annoyed but people are losers who just want to be winners, or at least not be losers and most don't have the integrity to get to it the right way so they cheat, it sucks but it's life. My advice, do like I do and always root for the underdog and the loser and the minute they win, drop them and move on to the next underdog or loser and don't worry, that old underdog who won that you no longer champion will have plenty of new "fans" to keep them feeling "good?"

In conclusion, reggae music right now means it's something that someone wants to know the meaning to of others. What does PIZZA MEAN TO YOU?

-Me-
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby feury » Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:48 pm

EVERYTHING
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Ranking Glasses » Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:18 am

Novice wrote:
Maybe YOU, as a black man, want to feel a closeness or have a relationship with the music you think is superior to that of a white man, maybe it's your ego out of control or maybe you've enjoyed it for so long before it was "hip" or before everyone else caught on and now you feel like your appreciation before all that is not being appreciated or acknowledged..
-Me-


It's not that I want to feel but I do feel because reggae has been part of my life since birth. It's from my parent's country and it speaks of my history and my people's struggles and achievements. I've said that different people enjoy the music at different levels and I acknowledge that so it should also be acknowledged that it's part of my DNA. It's not me being superior, I'm actually a very ordinary bloke, it's just the world I was born into.
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Novice » Sat Jul 14, 2018 6:24 pm

Look, I could say the same thing about a particular sound from Turkey in the 70's, the so-called Anatolian Rock or psychedelic music that has had a large resurgence, outside of Turkey, due to many repress/reissue labels. It too was protest music and some of the people in the protests/revolutions of the time payed dearly with their lives and many others were tortured pretty brutally, including people close to me. So I'm relatively confident in saying that I'm assuming the way I hear and enjoy that music is probably different than someone who might not know the history or language or background but are only able to listen to the "sounds." I'm assuming and believe that like any music, if it's honest and true and is saying something and is coupled with good musicianship, the "sound" will be enough to transcend any cultural or language barriers and people will feel it and get it, those who have eyes and ears to see of course....though I admit context does not transcend and some background is needed.

Though my enjoyment feels perhaps a little more "righteous" in my mind, for lack of a better word, I know that it is not and that's just pride/ownership f*cking with me but I don't let it succeed because ultimately I try to do whatever I can to try to get others to enjoy it the same way I do and to really try to get them to get down with it. That doesn't always seem to be the case with so called black music. I understand historically blacks have had too much taken away from them, and at times EVERYTHING taken away so it's not that I don't understand the reflex to want to hold on to anything and everything they identify with or is part of their history but the history and events of the past should be a guide to present and future behavior, it should not compulsively or traumatically dictate it. You should fight the urges you have translated in your mind as part of your "history" or "upbringing" because it is in it's own form a bit divisive and not about equality.

Realistically, what percentage of reggae do you really believe is authentically about history and struggles?? You have to know it's not that high and the reality is that once you could make money out of it or a particular fad or trend got popular and sold records, that's what was going to dominate and authenticity was CLEARLY not a prerequisite. The music can feed into what ever the individual needs from it or that individual brings to the listening experience based on what they have been through. You think I really give a single f*ck about Haille sellasie whatever?? No I don't but you might not know that hearing me sing along and get right into the music because it's all a metaphor to me...rastafarians praise what they do, I don't praise what they do, but I praise whatever it is I praise so when they say JAH, I'll repeat back RASTAFARI but I'm talking about what I MEAN not what they mean, at least not literally what they mean but principle wise we're probably talking about the same thing. I hear lyrics wrong all the time but most of it is my fault because I'm not really that concerned at first with what it is you're saying because I may or may not relate but if the music and melody and rhythm is hitting nice, it's doing it's job and stimulating my mind to bring out what I'd like to bring out and feel and it's no problem because eventually I'll listen enough times and hear what is really being sung but it's cool, the point has already been made.

The struggle and history of black people is probably more known to black people than white people so doesn't it make more sense for WHITE people to listen to it, to learn something, hear something and maybe understand something they previously didn't? People write songs for OTHERS and argue that sh*t all you want but if it was for themselves they would have kept it to themselves, you know like a diary but they didn't and I'm sure there are musicians out there who have said this is for black people or whatever and I can only feel sorry for them and call them institutionalized fools because to me it means they have accepted their sh*tty condition and only what allies in that acceptance as opposed to a change to it.

Here's a scenario for you, on the one hand you have a black man or woman who has suffered, your choice to pick the level and severity of the suffering and on the other hand you have another man or woman, lets say they're white and they grew up in a home where a parent systematically raped and tortured and abused them from the time they were babies until their teenage years. Now lets play some reggae or any other "black" music about suffering....you telling me the white listener doesn't FUNDAMENTALLY understand and relate and get EVERY part of the message of that music about suffering and justice and equality just as much as their black counterparts and do you think a silly thing like the color of the people making the music would even come into play once they are in the groove and feel the music uplifting them or making them feel like they aren't a piece a sh*t and giving them even a temporary feeling of pleasure and joy and sanity?? Come on Son!!

-Me-
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Ranking Glasses » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:36 pm

I knew several white people when I was growing up and many more now who are deeply into reggae music, some more than me. Working class white people such as the skinheads identified with the struggle, punk rockers identified with the rebelious element, and some just like the music for whatever reason. It's all fine with me.

I'm just saying that I was born into the culture. No need to write War & Peace, it's just my background.

The question was asked what does reggae mean to us. For you, it may mean nothing but for me it's a big part of my life and culture. Yes, most reggae songs are not roots but I like a wide range and roots was hardly played at the clubs and family events I went to anyway.
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Novice » Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:51 am

No need to write War & Peace?? Tell that to those microphone jockeys who can never seem to get to the finish line so the music can play on....if I have to endure that on those tapes and youtube videos and wack ass recommendations from people who think endless jabber makes a wicked dance then you can endure my stream of **** as well. Just pretend I'm saying it in patois and fill in the proper jargon and nomenclature to make it congruent with how you were brought up. Bwoy don't tell me Jamaicans don't take the simplest of topics and turn into a coloring book of endless metaphors and ramblings on....I would have thought with your upbringing you'd appreciate my inability to keep it short and simple, just sip your red stripe and read on!

-Me-
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Ranking Glasses » Sun Jul 15, 2018 6:35 am

Yes, and I guess we have to be selective in what we listen to. Some of the radio DJs in London are terrible but that's a whole new thread!
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Re: What Does Reggae Music Mean To You?

Postby Dread Archive » Sun Jul 15, 2018 7:11 am

The thread has got far away from music & more to do with essays & stereotypes.
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