Samory I = new album

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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby Inyaki » Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:00 pm

99thfloor wrote:
Inyaki wrote:Everything can be copyrighted (registered)...what is a 'backing (track)' in legal terms anyway.

There is no such thing as "backing" in legal terms, in fact there is nothing specified at all beyond "composition", what that means has to be interpreted, so there is just practice. I used the word "backing" to mean the arrangement (everything except the melody line), which in the past was not considered to be part of the composition, so not copyrighted.


...and it was wrong then. When I joined 30 years ago Copyright societies were using XIX century musical concepts. Technology and a few judgements have changed those obsolete musical concepts.
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby adrians wall » Thu Oct 05, 2017 5:42 am

guillaumebougard wrote:
jah_vaults wrote:Looks like the price will never return to $2.00 dollars a single or £2.00 pounds for a single. Which is what they used to retail for in most record shops without much problems until all the prices went upwards.


when was the last time you saw a single retail at 2 Euro/Dollars/Pounds???


Last time I was in the UK (April) I was buying brand new 7" for £2 a tune, not in a retail shop, direct from the producer but that is very cheap even for a wholesale price.
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby TruthTown » Thu Oct 05, 2017 7:23 am

It's not the price you buy from the producer we are talking about. It's the price in the shop. Including production, producer can sell each copy for €4 and see his own record in the shop for €14.
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby 99thfloor » Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:40 pm

Inyaki wrote:
99thfloor wrote:There is no such thing as "backing" in legal terms, in fact there is nothing specified at all beyond "composition", what that means has to be interpreted, so there is just practice. I used the word "backing" to mean the arrangement (everything except the melody line), which in the past was not considered to be part of the composition, so not copyrighted.


...and it was wrong then. When I joined 30 years ago Copyright societies were using XIX century musical concepts. Technology and a few judgements have changed those obsolete musical concepts.

I was never talking about what was "right" or "wrong".

As a musician who's contributions to songwriting hardly ever has involved vocal melody or basic harmony, but often much of the rest of the arrangement of a song (what is actually played, instead of some abstract idea), I found the exclusive emphasis on top-line/melody to be strange (but this would depend a bit on genre). As I have grown older I have come to think the whole concept of copyright on music, as in someone "owning" any musical motifs, phrases, or whatever the elements may be, to be questionable, but that is a different discussion.
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby TruthTown » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:48 am

A little reflexion by Nico Miav (Blackboard Jungle) in FB

Records price is higher and higher and it's a shame, WHY ???...one of the major reason is because producers and labels press less quantities, and they tell you it's because less and less people buy vinyl, THIS IS A LIE !!! people buy less vinyl because they are more expensive, and it's the fault of the label because they want to win more money with these "limited press" , and quick please !!! my opinion is if you start a bizness, label or other company, you have to look on a long term and the goal is to have your product available for a long time and sell the more possible at a good price...it's like if label today do bizness like in stock market...they want to sell fast at the higher price, they don't care about respect for the customer, they don't care about the musicians and singers who just want people listen their music...
Blackboard Jungle established his label 10 years ago now and our retails and distribution are still the same today than 10 years ago. Yes, you can buy a 12" at our session or on our website for 8€ . we still pressing 1000 copies of each release ( 7",10", 12", LP ) and we sell same amount of records than 10 years ago, and we still have in stock the majority of our references and still sell them to young people who discover reggae music and i can tell you they prefer to buy it at a normal price than on discogs at big price.
it's reggae music, music by the people for the people !!!
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby guillaumebougard » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:58 am

TruthTown wrote:A little reflexion by Nico Miav (Blackboard Jungle) in FB

Records price is higher and higher and it's a shame, WHY ???...one of the major reason is because producers and labels press less quantities, and they tell you it's because less and less people buy vinyl, THIS IS A LIE !!! people buy less vinyl because they are more expensive, and it's the fault of the label because they want to win more money with these "limited press" , and quick please !!! my opinion is if you start a bizness, label or other company, you have to look on a long term and the goal is to have your product available for a long time and sell the more possible at a good price...it's like if label today do bizness like in stock market...they want to sell fast at the higher price, they don't care about respect for the customer, they don't care about the musicians and singers who just want people listen their music...
Blackboard Jungle established his label 10 years ago now and our retails and distribution are still the same today than 10 years ago. Yes, you can buy a 12" at our session or on our website for 8€ . we still pressing 1000 copies of each release ( 7",10", 12", LP ) and we sell same amount of records than 10 years ago, and we still have in stock the majority of our references and still sell them to young people who discover reggae music and i can tell you they prefer to buy it at a normal price than on discogs at big price.
it's reggae music, music by the people for the people !!!


I'm sure Nico Miav knows a lot that labels don't

Peuh=leaze....
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby Ranking Glasses » Mon Oct 09, 2017 1:55 pm

If we stopped buying over-priced new vinyl they would:

- Press more copies and bring the unit price down
- Stop pressing new vinyl

The power is in our hands.
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby guillaumebougard » Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:23 am

check out this manufacturing plant's price list

http://www.squeezer.fr/en/price-list/12-inches-vinyl

go to Big Wax 4 for a 12" with a color sleeve

it's 1215E for 300 copies = 4.05Euro/copy

then add mechanicals that are 9% of wholesale price, so if the label sells at 7 Euro wholesale, add 63 cents

you're now at 4.68 Euro / copy

add royalties, 20% of wholesale for licenses = 1.40 Euro

you're now at 6.08 Euro / copy

and you haven't factored in mastering the track, paying a graphic artist, let's say 250 Euro for mastering and same for the graphic artist = 500 / 300 = 1.67 euro

you're now at 7.75 Euro / copy

mind you, your wholesale price is 7 Euro!!!

and you havent paid for yourself, for your utilities (phone, internet, other costs of doing business like having an accountant for your company, paying taxes, etc...)

so yes, a label is literally forced to sell at more than 8 Euro. 10 Euro doesnt even cut it.

So if you sell your 300 copies at 10 Euros, you receive 3,000, with nothing left for yourself

The retailer is forced to cover his own costs and HAS to sell at a much higher price to make a living.

we're now at a bare minimum of 20 Euros retail price, plus VAT = 24 Euros

However, not all releases sell 300 copies, and when they do, it is perfectly understandable that the price be higher to pay for the ones that don't sell

I just don't know how to do it differently and would be happy to listen to tips from people who are operating labels (as opposed to armchair warriors with no real world experience of how things work)
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby Ranking Glasses » Wed Oct 11, 2017 6:28 am

Isn't the whole point about music with a profound message that it should reach as many people as possible? Otherwise what's the point?
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby finbar » Wed Oct 11, 2017 2:19 pm

Ranking Glasses wrote:Isn't the whole point about music with a profound message that it should reach as many people as possible? Otherwise what's the point?


Wisdom and enlightenment come at a cost :shock:
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby jah_vaults » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:19 pm

Nothing is for free
CLICK THE LINK TO BUY more items NOW ADDED. Ska, Studio one, Rocksteady, Coxsone, Lee Perry, Treasure Isle, Dancehall, Digital, Dub, Roots Reggae & Ragga C.D.s & Vinyl http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/jah_vaults/m. ... 4340.l2562
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby jb welda » Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:07 pm

If the best one can do, world wide, is sell 300 copies of a record, then face it: you're done. There is no market. Might as well fold up your tent and go home.

But I realize that is what some press and then that becomes the number they "sell", assuming eventually the producer gets them all off for money. Still, pretty hard to grasp that selling three hundred blinkin copies is that hard.

I don't know how the economies of scale operate here, but seems to me 300 copies is a mighty limited run. For reals.

one love
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby Anbessa » Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:39 pm

jb welda wrote:If the best one can do, world wide, is sell 300 copies of a record, then face it: you're done. There is no market. Might as well fold up your tent and go home.


I only manage to sell 300 copies of my releases world wide. To be honest, I more than once considered "folding up my tent and going home". But I keep doing it, because I love to be in a studio in Kingston for hours with my musical heroes, or with my friends in Switzerland, working on horns lines. Because I love to see the smile on faces of singers who have been doing this for 50 years, when they listen to what they've just recorded, or discover the final mix a year later. Because I love to get an email from a guy in Brazil I've never met telling me he loves my song and plays it on his sound system. Or even better, when someone tells me his 3 year old daughter always starts dancing in the living room when he plays it.

That sincerely makes it worth all the time and money. It's priceless.
www.soulofanbessa.com
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby jah_vaults » Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:06 pm

Anbessa wrote:
jb welda wrote:If the best one can do, world wide, is sell 300 copies of a record, then face it: you're done. There is no market. Might as well fold up your tent and go home.


I only manage to sell 300 copies of my releases world wide. To be honest, I more than once considered "folding up my tent and going home". But I keep doing it, because I love to be in a studio in Kingston for hours with my musical heroes, or with my friends in Switzerland, working on horns lines. Because I love to see the smile on faces of singers who have been doing this for 50 years, when they listen to what they've just recorded, or discover the final mix a year later. Because I love to get an email from a guy in Brazil I've never met telling me he loves my song and plays it on his sound system. Or even better, when someone tells me his 3 year old daughter always starts dancing in the living room when he plays it.

That sincerely makes it worth all the time and money. It's priceless.


Legendary quote
CLICK THE LINK TO BUY more items NOW ADDED. Ska, Studio one, Rocksteady, Coxsone, Lee Perry, Treasure Isle, Dancehall, Digital, Dub, Roots Reggae & Ragga C.D.s & Vinyl http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/jah_vaults/m. ... 4340.l2562
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Re: Samory I = new album

Postby Reggie Love » Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:05 am

Keep up the works, Anbessa. I haven't bought any of your records, i'll be honest, because I rarely buy singles. Have you brought out or are you planning to release an album/cd compilation of your productions. I would definitely buy that. Judging by your excellent mixes, your have superb tastes!
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