The Thrill Is Gone

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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby Reggaemusicstore » Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:30 am

dan i dubdub wrote:.

I hear people talking about the amount of duff tunes, when hasn't that been the case? I remember going to the Music & Video Exchange in Shepherds Bush when I was growing up and their whole basement was full of duff reggae, even then! You've always had to go crate digging and look past hype.


Dan, one of the minus points about some current reggae for me is we now have a lot of people who aren't good enough to release tunes but they're putting them out anyway and it's dragging the standards down. There are some excellent new releases coming out by young producers who've obviously put a lot of time and effort into their work. But we also have a lot of people who in my opinion just aren't up to scratch and are putting out tunes which are really little more than badly produced demos. I also used to trawl the record & tape exchanges etc many years ago & I agree there were lots of tunes then which didn't do it for me, but that's cos they weren't my style, meaning they were typically major chord JA tunes or lovers, early dancehall etc which I never went for. One thing you can't accuse Jamaicans back then of is poor musicianship, even if you didn't like the tunes they were properly played, mixed & produced and for me that's the big difference with much of what I hear now. It' not that the current style isn't to my taste but more that some of the producers aren't good enough to be releasing music. IMHO.
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby Apostle » Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:31 am

I agree with Steve's point of view up here.
As I stated in a previous thread on this board, the nowadays emphasis of a lot of reggae lovers on collecting and reissueing old music is very significant for the state that the music is in today. There has never been more attention for reggae, and there are more soundsystems playing than ever and people that are familiar with the phenomenon. But it seems most listeners are looking back, and even though there's a lot of good music coming out today there's few musicians and live bands then in the golden years.
At the other hand, it's clear that these days are over, but reggae has influenced so much good new music and new genres. It has definitely left its corner of the 'slow, boring, all sounds the same to me'-music. It is played at so much places outside of a 'strictly reggae' environment. I think the reggae lovers that are looking back reminisce the days that roots was roots, so it's quite evident that you keep on hearing the same material and versions over and over and over. You can't except they will be making good roots forever, music is always moving and becomes history, just like everything else.
Like Mikus says, I never get tired of a good soundsystem and there's still loads of exciting music being made. But it will be different from the early days everyone talks about. Bevause these days are over, naturally.
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby mikus » Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:26 am

Reggaemusicstore wrote:
dan i dubdub wrote:.
One thing you can't accuse Jamaicans back then of is poor musicianship, even if you didn't like the tunes they were properly played, mixed & produced and for me that's the big difference with much of what I hear now.

I wonder if we'll see a renaissance in live music (reggae and beyond)? We've gone through a computer revolution the last 20/30 years and I think the backlash to that is slowly happening.

One problem is the economics have changed - Studio One and other house bands were paid by the week and worked so hard every day. The expense of putting a band together and even having 3 rehearsals is unfordable to most - computers have changed the viability of making music - more people can have a go, but that serious producer level has become harder to fund. I'm hoping there'll be a new wave of live, instruments produced new reggae - there already are signs of those green shoots I think.

That said I love a lot of the digi stuff too, especially on a sound, so theres room for both. I'm sure it'll all be fine! No thrill gone here....
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby dan i dubdub » Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:41 am

I agree with so much of what you said there Steve. The terrible demo quality releases are what was making me think the new music had gone stale. Just glad there is some quality coming up to the surface now. Long may it last.
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby rumdrunk » Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:41 pm

good thread!

i've had these moments too, but they did never last very long

If you've had enough, you need to act yourself and: either get different input or push youself in deeper :)

I think a big part of keeping the interest is sharing and interacting with other people and their tastes. I am connected in reggae to friends and playing for people which of course pushes me further and further into the music. When a certain saturation is reached (also selecters hear their own records A LOT), then don't push on, try different (sub) genres / stay absent you will have some fun there and when u're done u'll be happy to get back to reggae.

Also a part in getting older and loosing interest is possibly due to shortened consumption of certain substances which made things a little more vivid than they actually were ;)
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby pinup » Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:11 pm

Apostle wrote: It has definitely left its corner of the 'slow, boring, all sounds the same to me'-music. It is played at so much places outside of a 'strictly reggae' environment.


I think this is a very relevant point. I have a residency at a local club night where I used to play dubstep and then finish with a few roots tunes, one month I asked if I could play a few more roots bits and they went down a treat. Now I'm playing an hour of reggae, albeit a broad spectrum of the genre, at a night where the other DJ's are playing Drum n Bass/House and people are absolutely loving it.


As a young listener it's hard for me to have lost the thrill considering I've only been collecting for 2 years but I can empathise with people who say they have. I used to get that thrill with Dubstep but now except for a few artists/labels nothing that's being released excites me at all.
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby finbar » Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:53 pm

While people may disagree on the time boundries, most people agree that reggae has already past it's "golden age". It would be impossible to re-create the creative explosion that occurred in Jamaica and lasted a generation or more, because it was based on a confluence of events.....the stars all aligning so to speak. I don't believe that it's reasonable to expect something special and unique like that to last forever, as nothing does. Look at all of the great music scenes of the 20th century (New Orleans, Chicago, Kansas City, London, Memphis etc.): all experienced a "golden creative age" that no longer exists, but these scenes are drawn upon as touchstones and wells of musical inspiration, and will be for a long time. The scene may be over, but the influence persists.

My interest in Jamaican music has broadened over time; for me my life experiences and the music are intrinsically linked, so It's not something I can even have an option to tire of and move away from. In fact the more I listen to the music now I realize how special it truly was. Personally I lost interest in what was "current" in the early 90's, when the scene started to cannibalize itself to an extreme previously unseen, but what occurred on the island for the previous 30+ years was stellar. That's not to say that there aren't any good releases since then, but they seem fewer and farther apart as time progresses.
Last edited by finbar on Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby edgar » Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:28 pm

mikus wrote:
Reggaemusicstore wrote:
dan i dubdub wrote:.
One thing you can't accuse Jamaicans back then of is poor musicianship, even if you didn't like the tunes they were properly played, mixed & produced and for me that's the big difference with much of what I hear now.

I wonder if we'll see a renaissance in live music (reggae and beyond)? We've gone through a computer revolution the last 20/30 years and I think the backlash to that is slowly happening.

One problem is the economics have changed - Studio One and other house bands were paid by the week and worked so hard every day. The expense of putting a band together and even having 3 rehearsals is unfordable to most - computers have changed the viability of making music - more people can have a go, but that serious producer level has become harder to fund. I'm hoping there'll be a new wave of live, instruments produced new reggae - there already are signs of those green shoots I think.

That said I love a lot of the digi stuff too, especially on a sound, so theres room for both. I'm sure it'll all be fine! No thrill gone here....


Unit 3 is a fresh exception. Their album comes out next month. And you can buy some tunes on itunes already:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpLHmwj9Hp0
thank you putting this on here- best reggae track ever, apart from most bob marley tracks
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby John Eden » Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:10 pm

I realised about a year ago that I had more than enough reggae to be getting on with and was less fussed about keeping up with new releases.

I still listen to Rodigan's show and play my tunes but rarely buy stuff. And what I listen to is far from exclusively reggae these days.
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby Chocolate Soldier » Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:47 pm

These days I still like sound system vibes, the reissues of gems, and the UK/Euro/Worldwide camp of producers...

For the reasons discussed widely here over the years (decline in standards), haven't heard too much emanating from JA for easily 10yrs which impresses, with some exceptions being Rory Stone Love, Alborosie, Stephen Marley prods etc.

For me the biggest disappointment with 'reggae music' was how messages of violence, intolerance, hate and extremism came to be in what had been a musical style previously generally associated with social consciousness, freedom, unity, positive attitudes etc - and this with almost no challenge whatsoever from the 'reggae fraternity' itself!

Its appalling to think that for young people who have gotten into the music, these negative directions are now the defacto norm.

I think one of the worst things to ever happen to reggae music was the arrival of artists like Sizzla et al...
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby KingSimeonSound » Wed Aug 07, 2013 4:08 pm

The issues of such content being more and more voiced and glorified covers a few genres out there. I was helping with some kids (under 10yrs) as they were playing some tunes at a party the other day and a good number of the tunes cut in with expletives. The kids were pretty passive about it.

About two years ago a thread on this forum mentioned a few things political... and it was locked or at least a mod came in and said that this forum doesn't discuss political content. I can see where it go's too far with 'Off Topic' issues, but as Choco mentions.. this music is inherently political, that is why there is more purpose and urgency in the music... I believe that is a part of what is missing in these times.

Sound is very much a part of where things are healthy in the world of this music, sad for the producers on sales.. but at least it is reaching a keen audience. Also interesting to note the cycle of culture.. that sounds are popular and have been growing and establishing the music to a newer generation.

Very interesting point to make about Sizzla. I can see where you could aim an amount of blame, but you could argue that phenomenon of Bob Marley, (not the man himself) has watered down as many cultural valuing of the music and culture. But that would be going a little further. I wouldn't want any of Sizzla's tune to be taken back, specifically the earlier phase. I think its at the feet of people themselves to look at their and their fellows behaviour and start to talk and work it out. It's a bit futile to just blame.. that aint no solution.
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby Roman » Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:28 pm

Chocolate Soldier wrote:I think one of the worst things to ever happen to reggae music was the arrival of artists like Sizzla et al...


Why? Only because the man refused to bow to conformity and political correctness?
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby Mick Sleeper » Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:00 pm

Chocolate Soldier wrote:I think one of the worst things to ever happen to reggae music was the arrival of artists like Sizzla et al...

Yes, the emergence of angry, reggae taliban types like Sizzla and Capleton certainly turned me off to a lot of new reggae. One minute they're singing positive songs, the next they're angry, spitting-in-your-face as they shout types using Rastafari to justify some pretty hateful lyrics.

KingSimeonSound wrote:...but you could argue that phenomenon of Bob Marley, (not the man himself) has watered down as many cultural valuing of the music and culture.

Also a valid point. The Marley Empire (TM) is responsible for weird things like Bob Marley soft drinks and incense that reduce Bob to a brand, a fun-lovin' Rastaman who wants you to feel irie in a new pair of his shoes, mon. :roll:
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby Chocolate Soldier » Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:44 pm

Sizzla 'Nah Apologize' surely represents the lowest point in reggae music history with the conceptual mashup of hatred, violence, intolerance, religious extremism & sexual vulgarity - all on a d-grade derivative hip hop style riddim.

The only thing which could have made it worse would have been some autotune..

When you consider the damage to reggae music's image, general sabotage and the sowing of discord in the scene caused by Sizzla and others, an agent provocateur could have done no better!

The infamous JA onstage brawl leaves little doubt as to the mentality of some of these figures:

http://youtu.be/UTitUwOroAg
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Re: The Thrill Is Gone

Postby Roman » Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:06 pm

Chocolate Soldier wrote:Sizzla 'Nah Apologize' surely represents the lowest point in reggae music history with the conceptual mashup of hatred, violence, intolerance, religious extremism & sexual vulgarity - all on a d-grade derivative hip hop style riddim.


The "hip hop style riddim" is not even Jamaican - it's a US production:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDgNY69Xrzo
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