HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby underated » Sat Sep 18, 2010 1:33 am

dougie conscious wrote:a very good reggae guitarist once said they only play 4 strings cos they cant play 6? called it cheating lol


I remember a few years ago i played riddim guitar for someone & they told me to play all six strings, [ i thought the guy was joking but he looked serious ], & he goes way back to studio 1 days.

So now i'm thinking perhaps some people do play full chords ?
If it is true, i could never play that phrasing.
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby dougie conscious » Sat Sep 18, 2010 9:20 pm

why play 4 if you have 6 ?
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby dougie conscious » Sat Sep 18, 2010 9:24 pm

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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby CHRIS RIDDIM » Sun Sep 19, 2010 12:22 am

dougie conscious wrote:why play 4 if you have 6 ?


Because...

1. it sounds better, sharper. cleaner, less 'stodgy'

2. The thumb does not have to provide the resistance for the fingers to fret the notes, the back of the hand is far stronger and more suited for it, quicker, sharper 'squeeze' when fretting the chord. quicker attack, quicker release

3.The little finger is freed up for occasional 7th notes

4. The bar across the top strings is stronger, cleaner as you can use the first two 3rds of the finger, rather than the fatty 'shoulder' of the index finger, the power for which must come from that furthest knuckle.

5. with 'marley chords' one can slide chords far easier, less pressure in needed to hold down the 4 lighter strings, agility is increased

6. bar chords require that 'erect' hand shape at 90 dgrees to the neck , 'marley chords' allow the elbow back so that the arm is in normal, relaxed position. Now the neck is closer to the body, giving greater control

dougie conscious wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAh1jwu9E_E
check dis


Thank you for validating my assertions with a nice vid of Hughie striking only 4 strings, despite the fact that he is using a bar chord shape. I suspect he isn't fretting the 6th string, he probaby frets the 5th even tho he does not play it, It's good practice, just in case, so if he hits that 5th striing once by accident, it will be the right note.

He does play a couple of SUSTAINED chords with 6 strings but that is not what was being discussed , It is the off beat 'skanks'/'chops'/'chips'/'fillets' that need to be 4 strings only and Hughie plays nice, neat 4 string chords in that vid. those strings sound a little old and 'coated' though, could do with a shiny new set.

Most important tip for reggae guitarist (and bass) yet, clean the ganja off your fingers before you touch your instrument, that stuff gets all over the strings. lemon juice is excellent for breakng down resinous residues on fingers.
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby CHRIS RIDDIM » Sun Sep 19, 2010 12:32 am

underated wrote:I remember a few years ago i played riddim guitar for someone & they told me to play all six strings, [ i thought the guy was joking but he looked serious ], & he goes way back to studio 1 days.


Did you see his hands? was he wearing a ring like this one....?

Image

Their agents are everywhere I tell you brother . Stay vigilant, keep up the noble martial art of the '4 string marley chord' fellow jedi knight.

Regarding Studio one, I love the music , vibes, the soul of Studio one music above all other Jamaican music , but some tracks feature some very ropey rhythm guitar
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby dougie conscious » Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:19 am

Thank you for validating my assertions with a nice vid of Hughie striking only 4 strings,
hes playing six,
any how the post was about bar chords only good 4 rock music,
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby CHRIS RIDDIM » Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:30 pm

dougie conscious wrote:
CHRIS RIDDIM wrote:Thank you for validating my assertions with a nice vid of Hughie striking only 4 strings,


hes playing six,


It sounds and looks very much like he is playing 4 strings, so I think on this occasion, you are mistaken sir. Dont watch the left hand, watch the right one and see that from the first 'strum', he is striking 4 strings. Ignore the fact that he makes the left hand position as if he was fretting all 6 strings, that is probably just because that is the way he learned and has never thought of doing it the other way. No disrespect to Hughie, I like his music , 'Move' is an excellent track

dougie conscious wrote:any how the post was about bar chords only good 4 rock music,


It WAS, then I explained why and then you started posting Marley clips in an attempt to contradict my examples of Bob being a fellow '4 string jedi ninja'. Then you claim that.....

dougie conscious wrote:a very good reggae guitarist once said they only play 4 strings cos they cant play 6? called it cheating lol


So how is it "cheating' Dougie? What is this 'rulebook' that you got a peek at which is hidden from the rest of us. Who dictates the 'rules' of 'reggae guitar'? the pope? Rules are only good for breaking and measuring penises with. I hope you get to claim your prize from this mystery "very good reggae guitarist" and he rewards you for obeying the 'rules' all the way through this 'contest'/'competition'/'tournament'

so 'lol' it up Dougie, It was you who forced me into this 'cul de sac' of analising video clips, despite the fact that one listen confirms the '4 string theory' (see what I did there? meme-tastic!)

So have you officially retracted your assertion that Bob 'chopped'/'chipped'/'chk'd' 6 string bar chords?
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby dougie conscious » Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:44 pm

4 strings six strings there still bar chords,the ones only good 4 rock,
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby Roman » Wed Sep 22, 2010 1:29 am

dougie conscious wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAh1jwu9E_E
check dis


Wicked, especially on 0:23 :lol:
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby LionYouthsMusic » Sun Sep 26, 2010 3:13 pm

"Every man do his thing a little way different"

The thread has been so good so far :D
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby Sir Bellyas » Thu Sep 30, 2010 4:12 pm

Why not follow the Clive Chin method as used on Alton Ellis' Too Late and dispense with the geetar completely and utilise the "cheese grater", probably one of those latin percussive wotsits, a guiro or whatever they're called. Saves all the pressure with the fingering and the chords and whatnot. For what its worth I'm with chris riddim on this one Dougie.
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby Chocolate Soldier » Fri Oct 01, 2010 6:40 am

Make sure you strum said grater in correct direction



Nice grater work kudos to Skully: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwYsHUfhhHs

http://www.reggaenews.co.uk/interviews/clive_chin.asp


You know that song [Too Late] was giving a little bit of a problem recording it? We had five musicians on the set and the guitarist was trying to feel out the song because it had a lot of different chords in it. A young guy. And Alton liked to work with professionals. We didn’t have like a Lynn Tait on the session or a Ranglin – one of them guys that could work out the chords then real quick. So Alton was getting a little in a temper with this guy and I call Alton to one side and I said “listen, the worst thing you could ever do is pressure one of these musicians, they’re not going to give you the best”. So we had to take him off of what he was doing and brought in Skully – a percussionist who plays bongo drums and stuff right? – and let him fill the space of the guitarist. And that’s why when you hear the final mix of the tune, it sounds so crisp. You hear that (MAKES SCRATCHING NOISE). But it wasn’t a rhythm guitar – it was a cheese grater!

Really?

Yeah! A cheese grater we brought in! Yeah man. And I want tell you when Alton saw I did that that he looked to me and said, “Bwoy… young Chin… You bad! Who could ever thought of that??” Was unheard of. Ultimately unheard of up to this day. And a lot of people sometime ask, “how you get that sound?” and me just laugh it off and say it’s a special mix… (LAUGHS)
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby underated » Sat Oct 02, 2010 5:46 pm

Never knew that was a cheese grater on that alton record, thanks for the info.
After reading that, i had to listen to that tune again. Yes it does not sound like a guitar, but it works & sounds good.
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Re: HOW TO PRODUCE OLD SKOOL TUNES? (vintage style)

Postby Radical Gee » Mon Nov 01, 2010 3:24 pm

I was wondering the same (how to produce old school tunes)
I tried many ways, you can check the result

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J951Lg_R4Ec
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Re:

Postby Viktorious » Mon Nov 08, 2010 10:12 pm

DC wrote:
Junior wrote:Sly's skills as a live drummer, has no relation to his drum programming. It's just an silly way to try to diss dancehall, but it's unqualified as a serious argument. It's a stupid book.


It definatly make a difference.. programmed by a musician or not.
For instance drum programming. I've heard many programmed drums where you can hear a hihat in 16th going on while there's a big drumroll goin as well. A drummer won't program that as he knows it's physically impossible on a drumkit. As also the feel in velocity.


I haven´t read the whole 12 pages of this thread but I´m a drummer, and I program drummachines. I often program drumpatterns thats impossible to play on a real kit just because I don´t want it to sound like a real drummer playin on a drum kit. I want the cheesy drummachine sound. I think Sly also program stuff that he can´t play on a drumkit.
But there is also often a drummer playing on electric drums (like Simmons) on the early digital tunes. That sound is harder to fake with Reason because its an analogue sound. I have a Simmons SDSV and if you record the snare the wave allways look diffenrent.

I'am a geek and I think its a difference between drumsamples and the real stuff. Drummaschines like the Kawai R-100 have a special groove. And if you want it to really sound authentic you have to learn witch sound you cant play at the same time on diffenrent machines. Old drummaschines also have a nice hiss/noise sound.
For more dubs, tunes and mixes:
http://www.soundcloud.com/viktorious-sound
http://www.soundcloud.com/dj-viktorious
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